The Scoop Live:富达数字资产总裁Tom Jessop

The Scoop的第33集与富达数字资产总裁Frank Chaparro和Tom Jessop在纽约的The Block总部现场录制。在下面收听,然后在Apple,Spotify,Google Play,Stitcher或任何收听播客的地方订阅The Scoop。通过电子邮件将反馈和修订请求发送到podcast@theblockcrypto.com。

Tom Jessop是富达数字资产公司的总裁。在这次谈话中,弗兰克和汤姆讨论:

  • 富达在服务机构或零售之间做出决定的过程
  • 保管人作为数字资产市场基础的重要性
  • 没有成熟的市场结构,为什么即使最好的技术也可能失败
  • 富达数字资产提供执行服务
  • 为什么将传统金融的各个方面纳入数字资产领域很重要

为方便起见,提供了笔录,请原谅由笔录过程引起的任何错误或错别字:

瑞安·托德(Ryan Todd)很高兴介绍我们的两位或一位客人。直接来自酒吧,我们有男人,神话,传奇人物弗兰克·夏帕罗(Frank Chaparro),还有富达数字资产总裁汤姆·杰索普(Tom Jessop)。

弗兰克·查帕罗(Frank Chaparro)非常感谢,我们很高兴举办这次活动。这是我们今年首次直播。富达数字资产总裁汤姆·杰索普(Tom Jessop)表示,这可以弥合华尔街与加密货币之间的鸿沟。我认为,富达数字资产公司有一段有趣的历史。如果回头看,回想一下阿比盖尔·约翰逊(Abigail Johnson)的时间-我记得我在《商业内幕》(Business Insider)时,我才刚刚开始报道这个领域-《华尔街日报》报道她在一次活动中说:“我喜欢这些东西。”然后在2018年1月,您加入了公司。然后在2018年4月,一位名叫弗兰克·夏帕罗(Frank Chaparro)的年轻,眼花bush乱,眼花bright乱的记者报道说,富达(Fidelity)是美国投资的家喻户晓的名字,正计划在加密货币交易和托管方面迈出一大步。报告在你们所做的事情上有些不足,但是您确实一直在花时间弄清楚你们将要把目光投向何方。然后在10月,您宣布推出Fidelity Digital Assets,一年后,我们在此托管贸易服务。引导我们完成这一旅程。

是的,汤姆·杰索普(Tom Jessop)是的,我的意思是,回到艾比(Abby)的评测上,我的意思是,看,我已经在富达(Fidelity)工作了两年,而真正令我印象深刻的是资本的数量,包括财务和人力,公司花在创新上。一个有趣的事实是,我们大楼的三层有一堵墙,在那儿有富达应用技术中心。在90年代初,富达(Fidelity)是最早推出在线交易解决方案的首批零售经纪人之一。现在,我认为当时会议室中没有多少人不是出生的,但这是以三英寸半的软盘和调制解调器连接的形式推送给客户的,以便与Fidelity进行在线交易。这比Web早了三四年。因此,您知道,该公司具有悠久的创新历史。因此,当艾比(Abby)首次考虑或了解区块链和无摩擦资本市场这个想法时,这实际上是与区块链技术一起出现的标语,在两个方向上推动了相当多的活动。一种是了解数字资产和加密货币。我认为,直到今天仍然存在的另一种方法是,了解分布式分类帐技术在金融服务及其他领域中的其他问题和其他商机的应用。因此,企业轨道和加密货币轨道。而且,您知道,我想你们中的许多人都听说过在自助餐厅接受比特币的故事。自2015年以来,我们几乎一直在开采比特币。

弗兰克·夏帕罗(Frank Chaparro)显然,艾比(Abby)在她的办公室里有一个矿工。

汤姆·杰索普(Tom Jessop)是的。如果您来到我们的大楼,您会发现,几代的蚂蚁矿工都在撑着敞开的门,以及人们的信条和物品。我实际上没有。你知道,我不知道为什么,但是没人给我一个。我对此有点不高兴。但是,创新和学习太空技术已有很长的历史了,当我们开始经营这项业务时,我们曾想过-在2018年初,我们说:“好的,我们已经收集了这些资产,我们“我们已经建立了一个钱包,我们拥有一些基本的交易能力,我们已经围绕这些功能中的一些构建了一些界面和应用程序。我们往哪个方向发展?”而且,正如我们许多人痛苦地记得的那样,那是泡沫高峰刚刚结束的时候。当我们退后一步说:“我们走哪个方向?我们认为我们去零售吗?我们会制度化吗?”我认为我们的观点是,体制性的山峰很难攀登,但那时候可能是一个更好的表示,这是我们建造的建筑的体现,以及我们在哪里可以最有效地应用它。这就是我们所做的。我们开始组装人员,其中一些是我们内部使用的潜在功能,然后将其组装到业务中,该业务现在称为Fidelity Digital Assets。

弗兰克·查帕罗(Frank Chaparro)何时才决定将其体制化还是零售化?

汤姆·杰索普(Tom Jessop)我想说的是2018年3月。是的,很快。

弗兰克·查帕罗(Frank Chaparro)因此,一旦做出这一决定,就在招聘员工,这使人们开始-

Tom Jessop全力以赴,构建其余的功能堆栈,考虑我们的许可方法,并考虑纽约州的信任许可,然后我们就开始思考当时的方式,然后再考虑如何最好利用我们已经在富达(Fidelity)与许多机构开展业务这一事实,以了解我们如何利用这一新功能进入市场。

弗兰克·查帕罗(Frank Chaparro)您是否曾预计,当宣布宣布托管时,2019年12月市场将有多拥挤?

Tom Jessop是的,我的意思是,看,我认为,监护权是一项基本要求。您知道,这是Maslow的需求层次结构。这是金字塔的基地。这就像您必须交付给人们以具有安全感和健全性的东西,然后其他一切都在此之上发展,无论是交易还是我们提供的其他服务。因此,我认为我们知道托管将成为任何人的产品中不可或缺的一部分,并且知道它将成为为客户提供的更广泛的战略和解决方案的一部分,但实际上,我们必须从哪里开始,这一点很明显。我的意思是,竞争性市场,就AUM而言,市场仍然很小,因此竞争非常激烈,但是,您知道,我们是一个已经存在数十年的组织,我们对该领域有长期的看法,我们并不一定要考虑接下来的18到24个月,而是要考虑太空发展的3年以上的时间,而且,这对于整个金融服务业可能意味着什么。

弗兰克·查帕罗(Frank Chaparro)好吧,在我们深入了解Fidelity Digital Assets的服务和产品之前,我认为值得保持更高的优势。看,你们从一开始就提到,你们喜欢冒险,不跟从人群。 Fidelity Digital Assets在多大程度上可以摇摆不定并尝试一些事情,而不是建立强大而强大的业务?

汤姆·杰索普(Tom Jessop)好吧,我认为这是两者的结合。我的意思是,我认为我们对成为该行业的重要参与者持认真态度,但我确实认为-随着市场的发展,我们开始看到这一点-成为先行者并有一点作为是有好处的领先市场。我认为即使在过去的12到18个月中,我们也已经学到了东西。只是,您知道,拥有这种商业心态-建立业务并必须说我们必须每天醒来,并为客户创造收入和价值-这迫使您真正地思考战略,如果我们只是观察并静观其变并进行试验,我认为我们不会有同样的机会。因此,我认为在这种情况下,建立强大的核心业务并推动其发展非常重要。但是随着时间的流逝,我们看到了新的机会,可以为生态系统带来价值,并想出将更多客户带入生态系统的方式,这确实令人兴奋,并且在许多方面正在验证,我们等待着,您知道,在商业活动中获得的收入。如果我们一直在等待,并决定“好吧,现在该是时候了吗?”,这些是我认为我们不会看到的事情。

弗兰克·查帕罗(Frank Chaparro)有多少是在试图吸引已经在加密货币市场(可能是Bitgo或Coinbase)中拥有托管人的当前市场参与者,然后将他们引入富达的平台,而不是试图说服那些不愿意参与其中的投资者和交易员。在这个市场上进行投资和交易?

汤姆·杰索普(Tom Jessop)是的,看,我现在要说的是,两者都是。我的意思是,我们肯定会遇到竞争情况。我认为,从长远来看,我们带来的价值实际上早已回到了这个桥梁评测上。例如,我们了解复杂机构的要求,并且可以带来其他资产类别所熟悉的能力和与生态系统进行交互的方式。

弗兰克·查帕罗(Frank Chaparro)是50 / 50、60 / 40 ..?

汤姆·杰索普(Tom Jessop),我想说这是60/40的新客户类型。

弗兰克·查帕罗有趣。是的与尚未投资加密的人们的对话看起来像什么?您是否根据数字黄金的想法,对冲或投资论点出售它们?

汤姆·杰索普(Tom Jessop)是的,我的意思是,我不能说我们以此类商品出售它们。我的意思是,我认为到这些机构中的大多数都来找我们时,他们已经花了很多时间思考自己的论文,对吗?他们认为,您知道,我们早先曾说过,您知道,我们在这方面往往很不耐烦。自白皮书以来,我们就已经存在了,比特币已经存在了。而且,您知道,人们的生存和死于代价。你知道,这是开始吗?这就是结局?但是,在华尔街金融产品周期周期中,这需要很长时间。信用衍生产品是在90年代后期发明的,但是直到2008年金融危机爆发之前,没人真正知道它们。因此,我认为,幕后悄悄地开展了许多工作。在某些方面,我们加强了人们关于为什么要在该领域进行投资的观点。在某些情况下,这看起来像是冒险的质押。在某些情况下,它看起来像资产分配过程。我们看到越来越多的客户正在做数学,并说如果我向比特币分配一些资金,这将有助于我进行风险调整后的回报。我们看到有人追求数字黄金的观点。有些人试图将网络活动和钱包活动与价格相关联。因此,我们开始看到人们对资产类别的不同思考方式(我们认为是健康的)的有趣去中心化。它不是整体的。并非每个客户都说,我认为这是数字黄金,黄金是我的基准,我们认为这是健康的。因此,我们所做的部分工作就是帮助我们提供自己的见解,以肯定他们的观点。然后,我们显然带来了能力和信任以及我们正在做的一切,以确保他们将成为良好的服务提供商。

弗兰克·查帕罗(Frank Chaparro)您最大的客户是什么?这些是什么?他们是宏观基金还是别的东西?他们是交易所吗?

汤姆·杰索普(Tom Jessop)好的问题。我们有一个大型家庭办公室。我们有一个分配给加密的大型宏观基金。我们有一些较小的加密货币专用基金。您开始看到传统分配者的兴趣,他们管理着我们正在与之交谈的其他资产的投资组合。因此,在我们开始的过程中我们已经看到过,并且我们决定在2018年初建立机构,主要是加密货币基金,我想说的是早期的对冲基金和其他类似的人。而且,在我们正在与之交谈的客户类型方面,我们已经看到多元化的稳定成熟。

弗兰克·查帕罗(Frank Chaparro)我们最近看到了彭博社的一份报告。今天还是昨天?

Tom Jessop是的,有70个加密货币基金倒闭了?

Frank Chaparro 70支基金已经收尾,很长一段时间,因此不一定是您的KYC或应用程序标准所吸引的客户。但是随着许多这类基金的关闭,那对富达公司来说是看涨还是看跌?

汤姆·杰索普(Tom Jessop)从短期来看,这是看跌的。这些人是潜在的客户,但我也想说,就像,您知道,在很多情况下,这是由于2017年末的零售推动或这些新兴基金中的一些形成并在随后的一段时期内结束的。 18个月-无论您是否会做,这只是您的经典,早期阶段。我的意思是,互联网时代的模拟是那些开始经营一项没人记得的业务的初创公司。因此,我认为其中的某些方面是健康的,但我们并没有真正关注它们,而是专注于即将到来的前瞻性业务和新业务。而且,我们确实认为,与您所了解的早期加密货币基金的潮起潮落相比,我们正在与之交谈的客户类型以及他们为什么对该领域感兴趣是更好的领先兴趣指标。

弗兰克·夏帕罗(Frank Chaparro)富达数字资产在何种程度上处于真空状态或不处于真空状态,我想我们之前已经谈到过这一点,您是如何知道的—当人们想到富达时,他们正在思考,现在知道零手续费交易,恭喜您,但实际上有大量的401k批发业务。您在多大程度上与FA一起工作,推动401K批发业务的人和其他人引入世界上Coinbase和Bitgos永远无法与之交互的新型客户?

汤姆·杰索普(Tom Jessop)是的,老实说,我的意思是,富达创新模式的一部分是建立新业务,分别为它们提供资金,并为他们提供实际走出去并执行的跑道,对吗?您知道,在大型机构中进行创新的挑战在于这些企业规模巨大。他们是庞大的企业,价值数十亿美元,拥有数万名客户。当您谈论的是处于早期阶段且具有更多类似风险的特征时,我们的资金是作为独立组织运作的。我们已经入职或正在计划中的每个客户在很大程度上都是我们自己创建的。我们将开始研究如何利用其他富达渠道来做到这一点。

弗兰克·查帕罗但是,那是一把双刃剑,对吧?因为当人们想到富达在加密货币市场中的价值主张时,他们就想到了管理或监督七点两万亿美元的大型公司的保证。但是它们是两个不同的法律实体。因此,作为加密货币客户,我是否有像401k客户,批发401k客户或经纪客户(等等)一样确保阿比盖尔·约翰逊(Abigail Johnson)落后于我的保证?

汤姆·杰索普是的。因此,我想说的是,公司绝对致力于我们所做的事情。这体现在我们为建立这项业务而花费的资金,以及我们从网络安全组织获得的支持,例如,据了解,仅此一家公司的员工人数就相当于中级公司的十倍。大小的加密货币创业公司。这些人每天捍卫和保护更广泛的组织,并且拥有数十年的专业知识。为数百万零售客户提供合规性服务的人们。作为组织的所有DNA和专业知识是我们业务的一部分。然后,我们在组织,保险和其他方面投入大量资金。因此,您知道,我们没有太多的客户来找我们,富达是否致力于这一工作?我认为,凭借我们的工作,所聘用的人员,我们提供的服务,很明显,您知道,富达的机构特征遍布我们的整个业务。

Frank Chaparro这就是客户的反应吗?

汤姆·杰索普正确。

弗兰克·查帕罗有趣。让我们来谈谈开展这样一种新型业务的政治。当您于2018年1月加入公司时,您所说的传统业务是否有任何摩擦,而现在您已经完全支持并支持您了?

汤姆·杰索普(Tom Jessop)我的意思是,我没有很长的答案。不,答案是否定的。几乎没有摩擦。同样,由于富达的创新墙是孵化并发展这些东西,随着时间的推移,在某种成熟度上,它们决定如何与组织的其余部分建立联盟。这与90年代后期华尔街的网络创新模式不同,某些组织将建立竞争实体来利用网络与传统企业竞争。那不是我们的模型。我们拥有的模型就是您知道的,您种植了橡子并且它开始生长。当您逐渐弄清它所在的位置时,它开始看起来很有趣。它可以保持独立,也可以与其他一些企业联合。我们还没有到那个时候。还很早。

弗兰克·查帕罗(Frank Chaparro)除了我要揭开一切之外,这次旅程中最艰难的部分是什么?

汤姆·杰索普(Tom Jessop)这实际上是一个有趣的故事,因为它仍然使我发笑。因此,您知道我们在2018年10月宣布了该业务。我想当时我们说我们将在2019年初开始运营。实际上,我们在年底之前在该平台上拥有了首个客户。这真的很有趣,因为我们收到了诸如“你们要发行一份您还活着的新闻稿”之类的人的电话吗?我们就像,“不,我们十月份告诉过你,我们会活下来的。”而且您知道,直到今天,我认为甚至在几个月前,人们都在问:“这些人还活着吗?”我觉得我们需要像是一架飞机飞越曼哈顿下城,就像“我们是活着的”。

弗兰克·查帕罗(Frank Chaparro)好吧,我认为人们对于您是否生活,该平台上实际可用的资产类型,执行业务的程度或深度感到困惑。您知道吗,我在证券交易商协会的克里斯汀·桑德勒(Christine Sandler)上台。她在观众席中。我说你们叫经纪人经销商,然后您拦住了我,说,不是,不一定是主要经纪人,我说。

汤姆·杰索普(Tom Jessop)我们不是主要经纪人,我们也不是经纪交易商。

弗兰克·查帕罗(Frank Chaparro)

汤姆·杰索普(Tom Jessop)明白了。好。我们活着,毫无疑问地活着。是的因此,我们现在提供的是托管服务。我们还提供了我们认为非常独特的东西,并且确实与传统机构产生了共鸣,这就是我们所说的执行服务,对吗?因此,考虑这一点的方法是针对传统投资者的,比如说在外汇交易或股票交易中,您浏览屏幕,为苹果下订单,在几毫秒内,您便获得了最佳出价者的报价。现在在美国的数十家交易所和ATS中,您可以在屏幕上执行。非常简单在加密货币中不是那样工作的,对吗?你是一个机构。您想以最优惠的价格交易。您需要在多个交易所开立账户,为这些账户注资,监视不同的屏幕,弄清楚要执行的位置,然后根据您的下一笔交易重新分配资本或比特币。因此,我们尝试做的是带来一个古老的传统形式,客户可以坐在我们的界面前,他们可以将其整理好,我们有竞争的做市商和交易所,我们可以有效地返回最佳出价或提供给客户,他们在屏幕上执行。他们不需要知道谁是流动性提供者。我们管理客户与有限合伙人之间的结算,这是传统投资者与市场互动的一种非常熟悉,舒适的方式。

弗兰克·查帕罗除了电子贸易公司,您现在还拥有交易所。

汤姆·杰索普(Tom Jessop)我们将在1月份进行我们的首次交易所,希望在1月。

弗兰克·查帕罗(Frank Chaparro)那是哪一个?

汤姆·杰索普(Tom Jessop)不会说。

弗兰克·查帕罗(Frank Chaparro)因此,让我们谈谈托管业务。我们谈到了执行服务,我的意思是很简单。 Tagomi之外没有很多竞争。指导我们进行托管,因为在这一点上,如果我再得到一家发布托管产品的公司的新闻稿,我将跳入第四街,因为我们需要多少?市场能维持多少?

汤姆·杰索普(Tom Jessop),我认为思考的方式不一定是您需要多少保管人,这是在这个领域中监护的基本职能要求。这是其他事物的基础,对吧?

弗兰克·查帕罗(Frank Chaparro)因此,这些其他公司只是在推出托管人,然后再做其他事情。

汤姆·杰索普我不知道。但是我要说的是,我认为我们不认为托管是我们可以提供给客户的唯一增值解决方案。

弗兰克·夏帕罗那么接下来呢?

汤姆·杰索普(Tom Jessop),其执行服务。我认为,您又回到了加密的市场结构。您谈论的是必须对所有项目进行预融资。我们将开始研究为客户提供便利的传统优质服务的方法,以将他们在其他资产类别中非常熟悉的这些范式带入该资产类别,对吗?但是,我想,您知道,您必须再次考虑,如果您谈论的是决定分配给该资产类别的传统投资者,则他们不一定在意二阶和三阶功能。他们只是想知道自己可以将数字资产存储在安全的地方,并且可以信任他们所拥有的机构,并且可以控制哪些人可以转移资产以及以他们认为合理的价格执行资产的能力。就这么简单。

弗兰克·查帕罗(Frank Chaparro)但是,即使就业务发展的长期前景而言,现在,您仍然必须面对竞争。

汤姆·杰索普100%。

弗兰克·查帕罗(Frank Chaparro)一些公司上线了像NPC这样的新技术,我什至无法开始解释或理解。我从传闻中得知,Bakkt对Galaxy和Tagomi的费用为零。面对这种情况,安克雷奇(Anchorage)和所有其他这些公司都上线了,您如何捍卫自己的阵地?

是的,汤姆·杰索普(Tom Jessop)是的,我的意思是,这是您在与我们打赌,我们已经将其他资产类别的这种机构能力带到了数字资产中,这是一个要素。因此,在不让观众感到无聊的情况下,这包括客户如何影响我们平台上的交易,被授权执行交易的一切,客户可以根据自己的业务建立自己的控制层次结构,然后将其镜像到就我们处理交易而言。保管服务与贸易执行之间显然存在着紧密的联系。我们已经看到很多客户以现金方式购买资金并在我们的平台上购买了他们的第一个比特币,而且非常无缝。在获取对我们的控件和我们的安全框架的第三方审核方面,我们已经做了很多工作,这再次引起了更多传统投资者的共鸣。而且我认为,关于安全性和稳健性的方法,看起来像是与机构对抗的机构,实际上是我们的工作方式。而且,您知道,会有一些客户对他们不感兴趣,他们将考虑其他因素,无论是一些性感的底层技术还是费用。很好。这还不是零和游戏。我们在这个领域还很早。

弗兰克·查帕罗(Frank Chaparro)当您与客户进行对话时,当您回头看时,可能是最艰难的谈判,可能没有解决?您如何尝试说服他们呢?

汤姆·杰索普(Tom Jessop)好吧,看,我要说的是,您已经知道,我们已经与很多对价格非常敏感的人进行了交谈,其中有些人改变了主意或选择了回来。

Frank Chaparro对其他提供者不满意的是什么?

汤姆·杰索普我不能告诉你。我认为这是一种感觉,我们正在提供白色手套服务。我们花费了大量时间和精力来构建它。这是一流的,一流的。我认为人们认识到这一点。而且,您知道我们的工作具有价值。我想说的是,我认为他们已经竞争地意识到了这一点。那很好。

弗兰克·查帕罗(Frank Chaparro)对您肯定有好处,是的。汤姆,让我们谈谈您。在打开麦克风之前,我们谈论了您在高盛的时间以及人们的生活状况,文章称您“不是典型的高盛人”,您相信这是真的吗?

Tom Jessop是的,对。

弗兰克·查帕罗(Frank Chaparro)与我们谈谈您在这里的时间以及您的工作。

汤姆·杰索普(Tom Jessop)是的。瞧,我是在职业生涯的晚些时候来到高盛的,当时我就像是一个来自行业之外的人,我有点像,哇,这个地方会是什么样子,你知道吗?因为我有相同的也许是外在的看法,所以很多人都会这样做,只是基于您在新闻界阅读的内容等等。您知道,到目前为止,这是一个了不起的工作场所。我在那里呆了17年,比我想象的要长得多,而且这是一个令人难以置信的大学驱动的商业环境。我就是,我就是我,你知道。而且我很容易相处。我想我做得很好。而且,那对我有用。

弗兰克·夏帕罗那么你在那儿做什么?

Tom Jessop因此,我是证券部门战略投资团队的成员。当我离开时,我们认为我们的团队可能获得了大约10亿美元的资金,主要是资产负债表上的金融科技投资。我认为有趣的是,我们进行了很多市场结构投资。因此,您知道IHS Market,它现在是一家上市公司,最初是一家初创公司,在该公司中,Lance和Kevin和团队正在有效地从银行收集CDS定价数据,并提出对其进行合成,规范化并给他们打分回来,这创造了每个人都想要购买数据的飞轮。但是起初,这更像是我们认为银行需要一种服务来对这些东西进行定价。那就成了生意。贸易网是另一个。

弗兰克·查帕罗当然,他们刚刚上市。

汤姆·杰索普(Tom Jessop)您如何通过允许销售人员开展更多业务的方式促进销售人员与其客户之间的更多互动?而且,您知道,这是一个伟大的15年,20年的故事,但这涉及市场结构。我们开始了交易所,交易平台。当我想到这个空间时,我一直牢记的一件事是,这需要时间,而最好的技术并不一定会赢。在创建必须耐心的市场方面,这具有社会方面的意义,您必须创建正确的激励结构和植物群,以使人们团结起来并创造价值。我们一次又一次看到。对于我们所投资的一切都是成功的-您知道,一些非常成功的交易所,一个贸易网-有许多您从未听说过失败的公司。他们可能拥有伟大的技术,但是他们无法以实际推动事情发展的方式来组织整个行业。在某种程度上,我认为这就是我们所有人都在试图做的事情,这就是您如何创建那些吸引更多人进入市场的先决条件?您知道,我们作为富达数字资产正在这样做。我们一直在与生态系统中的其他成员进行不断的讨论,讨论如何改善市场结构和创造,我不会称之为实用工具,而是为了使太空中的每个人都受益并为机构带来更好的收益的功能,因为从5至10年的角度来看,这将推动该领域的大规模采用。它将不会是一个在彼此之间进行交易的加密货币本机类型的封闭世界。

弗兰克·夏帕罗(Frank Chaparro),当您看市场结构时,我的意思是,您不一定能即插即用在股票中起作用,在固定收益或大宗商品中起作用而又将其插入加密货币世界,但是当您回顾自己的时间时,高盛证券部门,您认为加密货币世界在那个成熟时期现在能学到什么?

汤姆·杰索普(Tom Jessop),我想对每个认识的人说,像我们这样生活,这需要时间,对吗?因此,我认为成功并不一定需要数周和数月的时间。可能要几个月到几年。并且为此做好准备,无论是作为一家初创企业,还是您筹集的资金或您对战略的看法。我认为这很重要。我还认为,人们已经认识到,尽管我们希望技术带来的所有新颖的方面,但您仍然需要围绕它进行一些传统的盘点才能获得-。

Frank Chaparro这是什么意思?

汤姆·杰索普(Tom Jessop),我的意思是,经典的例子,对吗?数字资产的本质是它们仍然是主权的。您可以自我监护。那么为什么要有一个托管人呢?好吧,出于多种原因,应该有一个托管人。保管人不仅提供保管钥匙,还提供许多服务。而且,在某些情况下,还有哪些法规要求或客户选择什么,对吗?因此,我认为,这确实是找到一种方法,可以利用传统的和熟悉的方法将新事物带给特定人群,至少在早期,这对于实现这种过渡非常重要。然后,有一天我们会醒来,您知道,人们会对此感到更加自在。他们将围绕这些投资更好地制定论文。他们将需要不同类型的服务。但是,这是-您知道,我不想继续使用这种桥梁类比,但如果您想使这一新事物成功,我想您就是无法完全摒弃传统金融中的某些人工产物。

弗兰克·查帕罗(Frank Chaparro)当该区块首次推出时,即我们在2018年10月处于起步阶段时,对我们来说是重要的一个月,因为你们宣布Erisx上线了。我认为还有其他一些人也发布了类似的公告。当时的这些机构力量是Bakkt,对吗?他们原定于12月发射,但从未成功。 But it was a big moment in terms of the institutionalization of the market, and I think a lot of people thought it'd be a panacea for market structure and for price and it necessarily wasn't. It speaks to your point about how things don't necessarily happen overnight. As my grandmother said, Rome wasn't built in a day. But there are still pain points, and there are a lot of pain points. What are the ones that Fidelity can't fix right now?

Tom Jessop That we can't fix? Look, I think that's a great question. I mean, I think if part of your thesis around broader adoption of these assets in the institutional realm involves funds, which it does right. Different ways for folks to access or get exposure to the space. You know, the underlying liquidity in the markets right now would not support, you know, billions of dollars in new capital coming into Bitcoin as an example, right? So there's a little bit of a chicken and egg. And in fact, a lot of institutions would think, you know, quite frankly, think about that as a factor as to whether they're going to allocate in the first place, right? Which is, "If I buy 100 million a Bitcoin over the course of a few days, how badly will I move the market? If I need to liquidate quickly, what will that look like?" So I still think from a liquidity standpoint, there's a lot of work that needs to be done.

Frank Chaparro So what happens when a client comes to you with an order? Has anyone even come to you with an order anywhere close to that size?

Tom Jessop No. No.

Frank Chaparro What if they did? A fraction.

Tom Jessop Yeah. I mean, I think look, that's up to them. We don't facilitate the trading. They're not giving us the order, and we're not putting it into the market. We provide them with the tools to assess the market. But it's entirely up to them in terms of the size of their orders, how frequently they place those orders in the market. I think our hope and intention is over time that we can provide better tools to do that, trading algorithms and other things. But that's a great question. I mean, you know, for the clients that have executed on our platform–reasonably-sized orders, you know, they clearly chunk them up into smaller sizes, they may not execute all those orders in a day–I wouldn't say it's a black card, but, you know, the market's quite volatile, they have to have an idea when they want to execute.

Frank Chaparro The interesting thing to me writing about this space is the power–and I think this goes unnoticed–of market-making firms and electronic over-the-counter traders like Jump, Jane Street. Many of these firms are the companies that are getting all this inbound retail flow, not the exchanges. You haven't on-boarded an exchange yet. You think about Tagomi. The majority of their flow is going to OTC or electronic trading firms. Is that the future of this market, are the exchanges going to be left in the dust or will the market-makers reign supreme?

Tom Jessop It's a great question. It's one that we think about a lot. I think it's too early to tell. I mean, I think they're probably folks in the audience that are more current on institutional equities than I am. But look, for a long time, you had a central limit order book, displayed liquidity in equities, but you still had folks facilitating large orders of OTC, right. And then writing the trades to the tape. And so you had this hybrid model. It still exists to someday. My guess is that listed equities have become more electronic and maybe less high-touch or less high-value block trading. I know there's something in me that says at some point it becomes looks more like a central mid-order book, but that's just more of a thesis as opposed to something that's supported in fact and careful observation. I don't know.

Frank Chaparro For the non market structure wonks among us, break that down.

Tom Jessop Central order book is, you know, buyers and sellers displayed price, depth of book, execute on the screen, and then OTC would be obviously trades that are not publicized, negotiated privately. I wouldn't say not a competitive market, but perhaps not as competitive as having lots of market-makers filling out a book on an exchange.

Frank Chaparro Fair enough. You can't–you know, we're not going to pull a crystal ball. But to put the question differently, why today is Fidelity routing to market-makers and not exchanges?

Tom Jessop That's a great question.

Frank Chaparro Are the market-makers just easier to work with?

Tom Jessop No, I mean, I think given who are clients or other institutions, they trade in larger size. I think right now there's probably better size liquidity with OTC providers than what's displayed in an order book. That can change.

Frank Chaparro Why do you think the market structure is in that place right now? What are the exchanges doing wrong maybe?

Tom Jessop I don't know if they're doing anything wrong. I mean, some of these exchanges are generating a significant volume. And I don't know if there's public data on how much the OTC desks trade versus a typical exchange in a day. But, you know, some of these exchanges are trading very large size. I don't think they're doing anything wrong. I think that it's kind of a preferred habitat thing. If you're a certain type of investor, you may be more attracted to trading in an exchange. If you another type of investor, you may be more interested in sourcing size liquidity over the counter. That's a construct that exists in lots of markets, still exists in Foreign exchange to some degree today.

Frank Chaparro It's interesting. And a lot of what's going on in crypto is being modeled off of the FX market. When you think about the next five to 10 years for Fidelity Digital Assets, what does it look like?

Tom Jessop Yeah. So the first thing I would say is, you know–and I don't wanna use the term bet–but we're focused intently on the technology and the types of assets that it can support. So our thinking is not strictly limited to the current set of digital assets or Bitcoin for that matter. When you think about an organization like Fidelity and you think about, for example, the types of transactions we intermediate today, there's certain asset classes that are probably reasonably well-suited to be tokenized and manifest ownership on a blockchain, lots of alternative assets. Increasingly, that's an asset class that our clients are interested in and they already own. And so there are interesting ways to think about traditional instruments and products in a blockchain format. For purposes of either, you know, more efficient distribution, automating certain types of corporate actions or other things, or even perhaps broadening the number of folks that are able to buy certain types of investments that only qualified purchasers, institutions and accredited investors can buy. And, you know–you're seeing this if you look at, you know, the public equity markets versus what's issued privately–there's been a slow and steady move for companies staying private longer, private securities issuance. And that's an interesting asset class when you think about the power of the technology. So I think that will, number one, be very customer-led in terms of their demands. Number two, thinking about our existing business and where we can leverage some of our capabilities and things other than the set of digital assets we have today. And most of all, make sure that we have the flexibility as an organization to pivot and course correct given how new and nascent these markets are.

Frank Chaparro That might put you directly in the sights of your crosstown fellow crypto firm Circle.

Tom Jessop I don't know. Too early to tell.

Frank Chaparro Sure. Good answer.

Tom Jessop The perfect noncommittal answer.

Frank Chaparro I mean, I'm sure if Jeremy was here, he would say something very similar. So what does that mean? Where do you see the first opportunity from that perspective in tokenizing assets that are illiquid? We often think about fixed-income assets as being–

Tom Jessop Yeah, I mean, you're starting to see it. I mean, I'm observing the same things you are. I mean, there have been–it seems like real estate, private real estate is an area of focus. You know, there are a number of banks thinking about bringing private instruments to market as tokens. It's a slow–I think the entire stock of outstanding security tokens and sort of non ICO stuff is paying less than two billion dollars it's still really tiny. But I think what, you know, you don't observe is that again, for institutions, it takes time to again understand, develop a thesis, check the box in terms of safety and soundness, regulatory compliance, other things. So there's a lot that's happening under the waterline that I think, you know, I wouldn't bet on this, but like, you know, I think we wake up one day and these things happen happening faster than we think, right? It just takes time. And so we're starting to see a little bit of that. I don't think–it's you know, it's a trickle that hasn't yet become a wave, but it's something we're watching carefully.

Frank Chaparro And so how do you position yourself for that? Are you hiring now to bring on people who can look at those opportunities?

Tom Jessop I mean, we have the people that can look at the opportunities. I mean, the benefit of having been in the space since 2015, is we've had, call it, folks with crypto experience. You know, back then they'd been in the ecosystem for a couple of years. And now, you know, they are pretty seasoned. And so, you know, part of what we do is obviously keep the business running, but we devote a portion of our resource, both product and technical, to think about prototyping and proof of concept and understanding how we can play as some of these things start to move forward. And then from a BizDev standpoint, we're very engaged with folks that are involved in this space and really just making sure we're monitoring what's happening and when it makes commercial sense to do so, to actually play a more active role in that part of the ecosystem.

Frank Chaparro But a lot of those new frontiers don't necessarily fall under Fidelity Digital Assets, they're–

Tom Jessop Well, I think in the long-term for any financial institution, I mean, if you believe in this, blockchain distributed ledgers as being a new financial fabric or whatever you want to call it, putting aside Bitcoin and Eth and stuff, I think you have to, if you're bought into that, I think you have to think about the eventuality that someday you wake up and your client says, "Well, OK, I own Apple stock, I own Bitcoin, I own this thing. Like, why can't I own a tokenized traditional asset in the same portfolio?" Well, you can because we have the capabilities to support that, and it should be completely agnostic to you when you pull up your portfolio and you say, "OK, you know, what's my total outstanding?" And maybe there's some risk analysis being done. It shouldn't be the case that the stuff that exists on a blockchain sits over here, and everything else you own sits over here, right?

Frank Chaparro What's the benefit, in your opinion? Not to promote our lovely sponsor, Cash App, who's a service by Square, which is run by Jack Dorsey. They've done a lot in the crypto market. I saw someone, I forget who it was, it was some crypto–

Tom Jessop Were you paid to say that?

Frank Chaparro No, I wasn't. I totally wasn't. A million Tron.

Tom Jessop Is that going to be edited out too?

Frank Chaparro So someone, some crypto charlatan on Twitter said if you really care about the digitization, tokenization, "crypto-ization" of the market, why don't you put Square's stock on the blockchain? And from my perspective, I don't understand the value add of that. The U.S. capital markets are some of the most liquid in the world. What benefit do I have as a person looking to buy 10 shares of Square, of that being on a blockchain?

Tom Jessop Yeah, okay. Now, that's a great question. I don't know. And I've thought this for a long time. I'm not sure that public securities and things that currently trade on exchanges are ripe for tokenization. I think that the market infrastructure is very well developed. You've got central clearinghouses, DTC. They do a very good job of running the markets and effecting settlement. I think that where you see the application of the technologies is illiquid assets, which are increasingly becoming a larger percentage of the overall pie of financial assets that folks invest in.

Frank Chaparro And I think that's a mark that so many people in the crypto market don't understand, necessarily. That you don't need to tokenize Apple because you can–

Tom Jessop I don't know what the incremental benefit would be.

Frank Chaparro You can own a massive position of it without moving the market, and there's tons of places to buy and sell.

Tom Jessop Right.

Frank Chaparro Let's focus a little bit about–you said looking forward, you'd consider listing new assets. It's just Bitcoin right now that you can buy and sell and custody. Not Ethereum, why?

Tom Jessop We, you know, we've done a lot of work on Ethereum. We intend to support it in the New Year. We're very led by our clients. And again, coming back to the fact that, you know, we're speaking to a lot of traditional institutions, Bitcoin is sort of like the gateway product, right? It's the thing that's got the, you know, perhaps the longest track record, the most observable data points across multiple exchanges around price activity.

Frank Chaparro Its opponents aren't going out to North Korea..

Tom Jessop That too. And so I think for us, like we're just very client-led. And I think that our clients are consistently and primarily interested in Bitcoin right now. It's that's simple.

Frank Chaparro But are there concerns around other things that are unique to Ethereum, the upcoming transition?

Tom Jessop I mean, there might be. But again, I think, you know, I think you just have to recognize that as an individual, you know–and I'm sure you did this and I did this back in the day, I found out what Bitcoin, I thought that it was cool, I downloaded a wallet and I bought some. Institutions don't act that way, it takes them time. And we did this survey–I think you and I may have spoken about this a while ago–but like, you know, the top three reasons why institutions were reluctant to get into the space. One is price volatility. The other one was lack of regulatory clarity. And the third one, interestingly, was lack of a track record, right? Meaning like, "How do I know that if I buy this thing, it's gonna be around tomorrow? Like what indicia of durability or longevity do I have based on the fact that the history of this asset is 10 years old?" I think many of these things solve themselves with time. But, you know, there are clients we're talking to now that have been thinking and looking at the space for years, over a year, not short months. So it's really that type of progression. There's a lot of things happening that are not necessarily observable unless you're speaking to these clients on a regular basis.

Frank Chaparro Will there ever be a wave of institutionalization?

Tom Jessop What, like suddenly, you know, the holders of 5 trillion in assets decide to pound the market with buy orders?

Frank Chaparro DE Shaw and the like come in and all…Point 72?

Tom Jessop I don't know if it's a wave, it might be a swell. I mean, let's pick another word that's not a wave. I think it's steady–you know, maybe it's more like a flood than a wave. Maybe it's just something that just builds and builds and builds. I don't know.

Frank Chaparro Tom, thank you so much.

Tom Jessop Thanks Frank.

Frank Chaparro Appreciate the time.

资讯来源:由0x资讯编译自THEBLOCKCRYPTO。版权归作者所有,未经许可,不得转载
提示:投资有风险,入市需谨慎,本资讯不作为投资理财建议。请理性投资,切实提高风险防范意识;如有发现的违法犯罪线索,可积极向有关部门举报反映。
你可能还喜欢